Talk:Global warming: Difference between revisions

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imported>Will Nesbitt
imported>Larry Sanger
Line 29: Line 29:
:I'm not really disputing anything (just a suggestion), but if you say so. [[User:Benjamin Seghers|Benjamin Seghers]] 14:07, 3 August 2007 (CDT)
:I'm not really disputing anything (just a suggestion), but if you say so. [[User:Benjamin Seghers|Benjamin Seghers]] 14:07, 3 August 2007 (CDT)


== "Very likey" as opposed to 100% ==
''I've deleted a discussion that did not begin with a proposition.  The Dispute Watch is very specific on this point. --[[User:Larry Sanger|Larry Sanger]] 05:15, 6 August 2007 (CDT)''
 
Our intro reads, "The prevailing scientific view, as represented by the science academies of the major industrialized nations and the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), is that most of the temperature increase since the mid-20th century has been caused by increases in atmospheric greenhouse gas concentrations produced by human activity." I wonder if it should say "is very likely caused by increases in atmospheric . . ." so as to mimic the IPCC language that suggest 90% certainty rather absolute certainty? [[User:Benjamin Seghers|Benjamin Seghers]] 14:02, 5 August 2007 (CDT)
 
Ben (Benjamin?), I am still assembling research for the counter-point. I have already identified several peer-reviewed papers which do not support some of the claims of Global Warming alarmists.  However, one of of the founding arguments I'm running across is that the IPCC is fundamentally biased due various reasons. How do we expect to address those claims?  I'm trying to run through Larry's new dispute resolution formula on other pages, but I've not gotten a good enough handle on my argument to approach the article sentence by sentence. I'm not a "global warming scoffer", but rather an ardent neutrality proponent. Thus, I'd sure appreciate some help "writing for the enemy" as they say.  Please let me know if you are interested in collaborating on that effort. If so, I'll start sharing some of my research. [[User:Will Nesbitt|Will Nesbitt]] 14:30, 5 August 2007 (CDT)
:Mr. Nesbitt, I don't get exactly what your counter-point is. Are you trying to negate everything in the article? There are many (scientific) papers that do indeed differ in conclusion with some of the IPCC's. I haven't really found any that in fact attack the IPCC as biased or fundamentally flawed. It's a body of scientists that synthesize a multitude of scientific papers into their Assessment Reports. I'm sure there are editorials or blog postings out there, but that's another thing. That said, I am sure there are genuine and ''bona fide'' critiques of the organization. But I think if we want to discuss the IPCC in that light, it should be done on the IPCC's own article. I'm for anything that will make this article neutral, but at the same time am opposed simply trying insert obviously flawed points or arguments in attempt to make it seem as if this were some 50:50 argument. Elsewhere, I've been labeled as one "writes for the enemy," whether correctly or not, simply through the introduction of scientific thoughts that do not mesh with the majority or some other. You and I are interested in the same objective, but we have to be careful to do so in the correct manner. For example, just above I'm suggesting we move from the absolutism currently in the sentence and go to the more appropriate and veracious language. I am also interested in exploring more in depth the roles of global warming and hurricanes, as pointed out above. It's just a matter of being neutral rather than countering each claim as false, because the latter is not neutral. [[User:Benjamin Seghers|Benjamin Seghers]] 15:37, 5 August 2007 (CDT)
 
 
Mr. Seghers, I'm not trying to negate everything in the article. I do think the article is flawed because a casual reader can't figure out what controversy is or what is being debated. ( I prefer Will.) [[User:Will Nesbitt|Will Nesbitt]] 17:56, 5 August 2007 (CDT)

Revision as of 04:15, 6 August 2007


Article Checklist for "Global warming"
Workgroup category or categories Earth Sciences Workgroup [Categories OK]
Article status Developing article: beyond a stub, but incomplete
Underlinked article? Yes
Basic cleanup done? No
Checklist last edited by Nereo Preto 08:23, 26 May 2007 (CDT)

To learn how to fill out this checklist, please see CZ:The Article Checklist.




This article talk page is now under dispute watch

See CZ:Dispute Watch. You're going to have to start using the {{prop}} template in the way that page describes, illustrated here: Talk:Oriental (word). We're testing out a dispute resolution idea, but I'm taking the test seriously. From now on, disputation on this page must be on-topic, and on-topic means (1) aimed at a specific proposition, (2) the proposition must concern the wording of the text, and (3) engaging in a dispute, as opposed to how to characterize the dispute, is off-topic. Call it the Anti-Bloviation Rule!  :-)

Note, for this topic in particular, that how much dispute there is about this topic is itself (pretty obviously) a matter of dispute. So we must not take a stand on that dispute, but must describe it. --Larry Sanger 07:17, 3 August 2007 (CDT)

So we must suggest a different and specific change in the article's text to dispute the content herein? Benjamin Seghers 09:20, 3 August 2007 (CDT)

Yep. But notice that the change can be: delete it. --Larry Sanger 09:22, 3 August 2007 (CDT)

Global warming and hurricanes

Proposition: I think we should expand on the role of global warming on hurricanes. I think this one area of higher amount of debate in the scientific community, with regards to how large an impact sea surface temperatures are having on intensity and frequency of hurricanes across the globe (as opposed to more natural factors, such as wind shear, for example). I don't know exactly what should be written, but there is much to say about the issue. Benjamin Seghers 12:43, 3 August 2007 (CDT)
This article is on dispute watch. This requires that all argumentation directly concern clearly-stated propositions about article wording.

Benjamin, please use {{prop}} if you want to make an argument--please rewrite the above (and then feel free to delete this) so that it is in conformity with CZ:Dispute Watch. Thanks. --Larry Sanger 12:33, 3 August 2007 (CDT)

I'm not really disputing anything (just a suggestion), but if you say so. Benjamin Seghers 14:07, 3 August 2007 (CDT)

I've deleted a discussion that did not begin with a proposition. The Dispute Watch is very specific on this point. --Larry Sanger 05:15, 6 August 2007 (CDT)

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