User talk:Andrew Su: Difference between revisions
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:After mentioning this, I'm not even sure if you are utilising the hide/show functionality in the protein2 emplate. I had noticed your intern experimenting with the idea and assumed your were going to include it. Sorry for any confusion. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 13:38, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | :After mentioning this, I'm not even sure if you are utilising the hide/show functionality in the protein2 emplate. I had noticed your intern experimenting with the idea and assumed your were going to include it. Sorry for any confusion. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 13:38, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | ||
:: I'll take a look at this in a bit. Maybe he made that change in a sandbox template. You don't happen to remember the link that says that PDB/RSCB images are in the public domain, do you? [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 13:46, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | :: I'll take a look at this in a bit. Maybe he made that change in a sandbox template. You don't happen to remember the link that says that PDB/RSCB images are in the public domain, do you? [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 13:46, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | ||
:::Possibly a sandbox, he had used it to hide the gene ontologies. Not a bad idea since that can be a very long list for some proteins. As far as the link is concerned, I have no idea. Try User:TimVickers at wikipedia. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 13:51, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
::::Looks like I did copy over the right template, just not something that is implemented here. In [[Template:Protein2]] the relevant syntax is right above the ECnumber actually. Anyway, I don't know enough of wikicode or javascript to take this much further. Hopefully, one of the pros can have a look... [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 14:01, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
:::::Well don't look at me. I'm sure it will get sorted out eventually and the code does not interfere with the funtion of the template. So best just to leave it in for now while we wait for it to become active. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 14:03, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
One more thing. If your plan is to add the protein2 template to the external links subpage(or a gene function subpage) we could probably revamp it since suddenly the whole page is available rather than cramping it off to the right. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 14:03, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
: Yeah, another one of those things where I played with it for a couple of minutes to convince myself I'd make things worse before I made them better. CSS wizardry (well, all of CSS is wizardry to me...) If others who have more experience come by to make the change, then great. If not, I'll dig into it later. Right now, still trying to gauge whether there's enough support/enthusiasm here at CZ to take this on in parallel to the WP effort, and/or whether it makes sense for me/us based on what's possible with CZ licensing... [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 14:08, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
::As far as i can tell CZ licensing is up in the air, still. I'm enthusiastic to get this going, either wikipedia or CZ. i'd prefer CZ due to the editorial oversight, that I feel would be a good carrot to attract the best academics. It might be harder to to convince them that wikipedia is the way to go. Here, the articles can be protected against random vandalism and that must be a selling point for the academic community. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 14:45, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
:::Yeah, I hear you and understand the arguments. The flip side is that WP has the edge on user/contributors, but of course we all hope CZ gets there. I'm agnostic right now (or rather, unsure of the better route) so I'm tempted to do both. Of course, this is assuming we can get the license issue worked out, but I'm hopeful. [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 14:53, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
::::Both is good too. We should not see this as competing projects, rather different projects. In wikipedia, while there are many, there may not be many interested in protein stubs. However, I'd be interested to see which ones do get adopted by members of that community. We may find that different subsets get worked on by the two different communities. It would also be an excellent experiment to see how the academic community responds given the option of both WP and CZ. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 14:57, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
==Function== | |||
I just added a [[CZ:Function|function page]] to the approved list for you. [[APP/Function|Have fun]]. [[User:Chris Day|Chris Day]] [[User talk:Chris Day|(talk)]] 18:12, 21 August 2007 (CDT) | |||
== Fine-lined version == | |||
I'm not sure why PDB uses the term "public domain" to release their material--they seem to have created their own fine-lined version of it, see [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki/Image_talk:APP_structure_2fk1.jpg/Permission here]. According to the PDB, the tag [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:PBB_Protein_APP_image.jpg here] is simply not factual. I thus made a special tag and re-tagged the images here so potential re-users can be fully informed about it. —[[User:Stephen Ewen|Stephen Ewen]] [[User talk:Stephen Ewen|(Talk)]] 00:54, 12 September 2007 (CDT) | |||
:Thanks for the clarification. perhaps this is something we need to clear up with the PDB folks... [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 11:25, 12 September 2007 (CDT) | |||
::Alright, it's simple, really. They simply are not PD materials and recently created works cannot be PD but ''automatically'' are copyrighted. The creator can, however, give others rights to use the works. This is what the PDB has done in a self-styled way rather than use a CC license, or the like. In short, the works are copyrighted and cannot ''not'' be in the case of a non-governmental federal agency author. PDB just allow considerable free use, and , and ''call'' it "public domain". WP and the Commons does the same thing, and, they have "created" PD-self, which really does not exist. But actually, they understand some of this correctly[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Granting_work_into_the_public_domain], although the term someone threw in there "irrevocable", is pure high-falootin' hooey. The CC folks recognize this stuff and have created their [http://creativecommons.org/licenses/publicdomain/ Public Domain Dedication], which even they appear to have doubts over. —[[User:Stephen Ewen|Stephen Ewen]] [[User talk:Stephen Ewen|(Talk)]] 18:36, 1 October 2007 (CDT) | |||
:::Another way to think of it is [http://www.primarilypublicdomain.org/ like this]. —[[User:Stephen Ewen|Stephen Ewen]] [[User talk:Stephen Ewen|(Talk)]] 01:01, 2 October 2007 (CDT) | |||
:::: Super, thanks for the updated information and links. I'll admit, this is one of those issues I'd just rather not think about... ;) [[User:Andrew Su|Andrew Su]] 11:28, 2 October 2007 (CDT) | |||
== Returning to Citizendium: an update on the project and how to get involved == | |||
Hello - some time ago you became part of the Citizendium project, but we haven't seen you around for a while. Perhaps you'd like to update your [[User:Andrew Su|public biography]] or check on the progress of [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Andrew_Su any pages you've edited so far]. | |||
Citizendium now has over [[:Category:CZ Live|16,000 articles]], with more than [[:Category:Approved Articles|150 approved]] by specialist [[CZ:The Editor Role|Editors]] such as yourself, but our contributor numbers require a boost. We have an initiative called '[[CZ:Eduzendium|Eduzendium]]' that brings in students enrolled on university courses to write articles for credit, but we still need more Editors across the community to write, discuss and approve material. There are some developed [[:Category:Biology_Developed_Articles|Biology]] and [[:Category:Chemistry_Developed_Articles|Chemistry]] articles that could be improved and approved, and some [[CZ:Core Articles/Natural Sciences|high-priority Natural Sciences articles]] that we don't have yet. You can also create new articles via [[CZ:Start_Article|this guide]], and contribute to some Biology or Chemistry pages that have been recently edited [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki?title=Special:RecentChangesLinked&target=Category%3ABiology_tag here] and [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki?title=Special:RecentChangesLinked&target=Category%3AChemistry_tag here] - or to [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges any others] on Citizendium, since you're a general [[CZ:The Author Role|Author]] as well as a specialist Editor. You may like to contribute to discussions in the [http://forum.citizendium.org forums], and might consider running for an elected position on the [[CZ:Management Council|Management]] and [http://ec.citizendium.org Editorial] Councils that oversee the project. | |||
If you have any questions, let me know via my [[User talk:John Stephenson|Talk page]] or by leaving a message below this one. Thank you for signing up and reading this update; I hope that you will [http://en.citizendium.org/wiki?title=Special:UserLogin&returnto=Special:MyTalk look in] on our community soon. [[User:John Stephenson|John Stephenson]] 09:25, 30 October 2011 (UTC) |
Latest revision as of 04:25, 30 October 2011
[User bio is in User:Your Name]
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Welcome to the Citizendium! We hope you will contribute boldly and well. Here are pointers for a quick start, and see Getting Started for other helpful "startup" links, our help system and CZ:Home for the top menu of community pages. You can test out editing in the sandbox if you'd like. If you need help to get going, the forum is one option. That's also where we discuss policy and proposals. You can ask any user or the editors for help, too. Just put a note on their "talk" page. Again, welcome and have fun!
You can find some more information about our collaboration groups if you follow this link CZ:Workgroups.You can always ask me on my talk page or others about how to proceed or any other question you might have.
Kind Regards, Robert Tito | Talk 13:32, 26 March 2007 (CDT)
Welcome, new editor! We're very glad you've joined us. Here are pointers for a quick start. Also, when you get a chance, please read The Editor Role. You can look at Getting Started and our help system for other introductory pages. It is also important, for project-wide matters, to join the Citizendium-L (broadcast) mailing list. Announcements are also available via Twitter. You can test out editing in the sandbox if you'd like. If you need help to get going, the forum is one option. That's also where we discuss policy and proposals. You can ask any administrator for help, too. Just put a note on their "talk" page. Again, welcome and thank you! We appreciate your willingness to share your expertise, and we hope to see your edits on Recent changes soon. --Larry Sanger 20:41, 3 April 2007 (CDT)
hide function
hi Andrew, one thing you'll note is that the hide/show function does not work here. I'm not sure what the problem is and have not looked into it too hard. If you figure out the problem that would be great. Clearly the protein template functions better with that option available. Glad to see you porting the stuff over here too. Was the test run a success in wikipedia? I noticed your intern beavering away. Chris Day (talk) 13:34, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- After mentioning this, I'm not even sure if you are utilising the hide/show functionality in the protein2 emplate. I had noticed your intern experimenting with the idea and assumed your were going to include it. Sorry for any confusion. Chris Day (talk) 13:38, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- I'll take a look at this in a bit. Maybe he made that change in a sandbox template. You don't happen to remember the link that says that PDB/RSCB images are in the public domain, do you? Andrew Su 13:46, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Possibly a sandbox, he had used it to hide the gene ontologies. Not a bad idea since that can be a very long list for some proteins. As far as the link is concerned, I have no idea. Try User:TimVickers at wikipedia. Chris Day (talk) 13:51, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Looks like I did copy over the right template, just not something that is implemented here. In Template:Protein2 the relevant syntax is right above the ECnumber actually. Anyway, I don't know enough of wikicode or javascript to take this much further. Hopefully, one of the pros can have a look... Andrew Su 14:01, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Possibly a sandbox, he had used it to hide the gene ontologies. Not a bad idea since that can be a very long list for some proteins. As far as the link is concerned, I have no idea. Try User:TimVickers at wikipedia. Chris Day (talk) 13:51, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- I'll take a look at this in a bit. Maybe he made that change in a sandbox template. You don't happen to remember the link that says that PDB/RSCB images are in the public domain, do you? Andrew Su 13:46, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
One more thing. If your plan is to add the protein2 template to the external links subpage(or a gene function subpage) we could probably revamp it since suddenly the whole page is available rather than cramping it off to the right. Chris Day (talk) 14:03, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Yeah, another one of those things where I played with it for a couple of minutes to convince myself I'd make things worse before I made them better. CSS wizardry (well, all of CSS is wizardry to me...) If others who have more experience come by to make the change, then great. If not, I'll dig into it later. Right now, still trying to gauge whether there's enough support/enthusiasm here at CZ to take this on in parallel to the WP effort, and/or whether it makes sense for me/us based on what's possible with CZ licensing... Andrew Su 14:08, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- As far as i can tell CZ licensing is up in the air, still. I'm enthusiastic to get this going, either wikipedia or CZ. i'd prefer CZ due to the editorial oversight, that I feel would be a good carrot to attract the best academics. It might be harder to to convince them that wikipedia is the way to go. Here, the articles can be protected against random vandalism and that must be a selling point for the academic community. Chris Day (talk) 14:45, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Yeah, I hear you and understand the arguments. The flip side is that WP has the edge on user/contributors, but of course we all hope CZ gets there. I'm agnostic right now (or rather, unsure of the better route) so I'm tempted to do both. Of course, this is assuming we can get the license issue worked out, but I'm hopeful. Andrew Su 14:53, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Both is good too. We should not see this as competing projects, rather different projects. In wikipedia, while there are many, there may not be many interested in protein stubs. However, I'd be interested to see which ones do get adopted by members of that community. We may find that different subsets get worked on by the two different communities. It would also be an excellent experiment to see how the academic community responds given the option of both WP and CZ. Chris Day (talk) 14:57, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- Yeah, I hear you and understand the arguments. The flip side is that WP has the edge on user/contributors, but of course we all hope CZ gets there. I'm agnostic right now (or rather, unsure of the better route) so I'm tempted to do both. Of course, this is assuming we can get the license issue worked out, but I'm hopeful. Andrew Su 14:53, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
- As far as i can tell CZ licensing is up in the air, still. I'm enthusiastic to get this going, either wikipedia or CZ. i'd prefer CZ due to the editorial oversight, that I feel would be a good carrot to attract the best academics. It might be harder to to convince them that wikipedia is the way to go. Here, the articles can be protected against random vandalism and that must be a selling point for the academic community. Chris Day (talk) 14:45, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Function
I just added a function page to the approved list for you. Have fun. Chris Day (talk) 18:12, 21 August 2007 (CDT)
Fine-lined version
I'm not sure why PDB uses the term "public domain" to release their material--they seem to have created their own fine-lined version of it, see here. According to the PDB, the tag here is simply not factual. I thus made a special tag and re-tagged the images here so potential re-users can be fully informed about it. —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 00:54, 12 September 2007 (CDT)
- Thanks for the clarification. perhaps this is something we need to clear up with the PDB folks... Andrew Su 11:25, 12 September 2007 (CDT)
- Alright, it's simple, really. They simply are not PD materials and recently created works cannot be PD but automatically are copyrighted. The creator can, however, give others rights to use the works. This is what the PDB has done in a self-styled way rather than use a CC license, or the like. In short, the works are copyrighted and cannot not be in the case of a non-governmental federal agency author. PDB just allow considerable free use, and , and call it "public domain". WP and the Commons does the same thing, and, they have "created" PD-self, which really does not exist. But actually, they understand some of this correctly[1], although the term someone threw in there "irrevocable", is pure high-falootin' hooey. The CC folks recognize this stuff and have created their Public Domain Dedication, which even they appear to have doubts over. —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 18:36, 1 October 2007 (CDT)
- Another way to think of it is like this. —Stephen Ewen (Talk) 01:01, 2 October 2007 (CDT)
- Super, thanks for the updated information and links. I'll admit, this is one of those issues I'd just rather not think about... ;) Andrew Su 11:28, 2 October 2007 (CDT)
Returning to Citizendium: an update on the project and how to get involved
Hello - some time ago you became part of the Citizendium project, but we haven't seen you around for a while. Perhaps you'd like to update your public biography or check on the progress of any pages you've edited so far.
Citizendium now has over 16,000 articles, with more than 150 approved by specialist Editors such as yourself, but our contributor numbers require a boost. We have an initiative called 'Eduzendium' that brings in students enrolled on university courses to write articles for credit, but we still need more Editors across the community to write, discuss and approve material. There are some developed Biology and Chemistry articles that could be improved and approved, and some high-priority Natural Sciences articles that we don't have yet. You can also create new articles via this guide, and contribute to some Biology or Chemistry pages that have been recently edited here and here - or to any others on Citizendium, since you're a general Author as well as a specialist Editor. You may like to contribute to discussions in the forums, and might consider running for an elected position on the Management and Editorial Councils that oversee the project.
If you have any questions, let me know via my Talk page or by leaving a message below this one. Thank you for signing up and reading this update; I hope that you will look in on our community soon. John Stephenson 09:25, 30 October 2011 (UTC)